Long-standing criticism and embarrasment.

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Long-standing criticism and embarrasment.

Postby Mach Front » Sat Feb 13, 2016 10:36 am

THAT'S part and parcel to forums and why they matter and what is missing from Google+.

I do not think Google+ is 'useless' but looking back or attempting to follow 'discussion' (such as they are) on G+ is an exercise in both futility and a venture into too-far and disappointingly shallow depths. Here I (we) am/are. Ahab in his quest over a handful of nearby summer rain ponds.

One can joyfully look over my own history at Dragonsfoot and see the multitude of incredibly stupid/ignorant things I said (especially when I first joined) and was yet semi-obsessed over D&D 'needing' both some kind of skill system and acknowledgement of just how (really and truthfully) dangerous rapiers actually really are/were, etc. Booorrriing. (Yet I even then wanted a fantasy version of such...still...yyaawwnn...who CARES?!?)

My own embarrassment, and more importantly, my learning, and how I learned by way of others' knowledge and opinions and insights and such...that's important. It's important no longer to me today, but it IS still important. It is still there for anyone since or now or tomorrow or ten years from now who may learn from what I said/asked and others responded. Google+ does not, will not and can not offer that. Forums did, do and will.
Others' ignorance and others' realization of foolishness will keep those that come after from wasting their time, effort, etc. and allow them to focus on things that help them to move forward and have fun. Things that matter more. Imagination. Fun. Whatever that fun may be and whatever language that fun might speak...

Forums keep us honest. Humble as we should be.
We cannot say: I am.
We that are, and were can just and only say: Here was I. Here I am. This is. I was once. (Perhaps) I ever was. (were we not, we will not, as we must say: I was, as you plainly see. Now, I admit my wrongs or ignorance or the change. I must explain it. I welcome it because it's there in front of you and I must, as I'm here it may be often neccessary that I will and I will as it is necessary or I again become dishonest. We must.
If we do not, there is no reason for us to be....here.
Google+, like Facebook allows us to verbally fart. That can and often is the end of it.
Forums can and do challenge us.
They don't let us get away with claiming we are awesome super know-stuff dude.
I guess that's "hard". Many are scared of that. I suppose they run to Facebook groups and away from where their old words still burn and they dare not mature to take ownership of, not just the easy part of where they are or where they may have been recently, but wherein they resided intellectually a few months or years ago.
Too scared of themselves.
A pity.
Why not learn. Why not acknowledge your own faults and say: "I was there. I, now, am not."
How hard is that? Is it really that scary?
It appears so.
Talk.
Learn.
Move.
Go.
Dare.
Allow others to see how you've become.
It's worth it to you and they.
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Re: Long-standing criticism and embarrasment.

Postby merias » Sat Feb 13, 2016 1:41 pm

Well said, Mach Front. My position on G+ is spelled out in a blog post I wrote a while back, this quote is particularly relevant to what you are saying:

G+ community search is terrible – you get a plain text box for entering search terms and just two choices for filtering results – ‘most recent’ or ‘best of’. That makes search pretty useless, no searching post titles, or comment bodies, or showing all results, or results from a particular sub-community – all of which are common features in web-based forum searches. It makes the discussions seem ephemeral – once it goes off of the front page, most people will never scroll down to see it. This saddens me – I like browsing old forum threads for topics that pique my interest, many going back years on places like Dragonsfoot, Goblinoid Games or the ODD74 forums.


Dragonsfoot, in particular, is a goldmine. The old posts of Gary's (Gygax), the posts from 2007-ish when the original retro-clones got their start, are all fascinating. Can you imagine if all we had was G+ back then? As you say, some of it was stupid, but at least we can see, and learn from it.

A decent case study is the Swords & Wizardry forum – this has been ‘dead’ for some time, just about the time the S&W G+ community was formed. I can’t help but feel that lots of great ideas and conversation have been lost or just never posted at all, simply due to the ephemeral nature of the G+ community format or someone not wanting to join G+.


I have to say, I don't begrudge Matt at all for letting the forums go. He may have just had enough with the spam registrations and the time involved in maintaining a place like this. In the couple of emails I've traded with him, he has been very nice and quite supportive of this effort.

And so here we are :). I just wish I had started these forums sooner.
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Re: Long-standing criticism and embarrasment.

Postby Mike » Thu Feb 18, 2016 5:42 am

Google+ is immediate and gives you access to the "top layer" of discussion. But when compared to a forum it's an epic fail.
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Re: Long-standing criticism and embarrasment.

Postby geordie racer » Wed Sep 07, 2016 9:04 pm

The old S&W forum hosts (hosted - it seems to be down at the mo?) my abysmal Whitebox Mystic class, which proved awful in play. A good reminder to me of how fiddly rules bite back and my own hubris.
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